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	<title>Comments on: &#8220;I guarantee you&#8217;ll see men in computer fields stating as fact that women don&#8217;t really want to be in computer science.&#8221;</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.shessuchageek.com/2007/04/17/i-guarantee-youll-see-men-in-computer-fields-stating-as-fact-that-women-dont-really-want-to-be-in-computer-science/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.shessuchageek.com/2007/04/17/i-guarantee-youll-see-men-in-computer-fields-stating-as-fact-that-women-dont-really-want-to-be-in-computer-science/</link>
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		<title>By: SFG</title>
		<link>http://www.shessuchageek.com/2007/04/17/i-guarantee-youll-see-men-in-computer-fields-stating-as-fact-that-women-dont-really-want-to-be-in-computer-science/comment-page-1/#comment-14749</link>
		<dc:creator>SFG</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 06 Jun 2007 13:30:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.shessuchageek.com/2007/04/17/i-guarantee-youll-see-men-in-computer-fields-stating-as-fact-that-women-dont-really-want-to-be-in-computer-science/#comment-14749</guid>
		<description>Yah, most of the pioneers are decidedly non-well-rounded and weird to boot. C&#039;mon, Linus Torvalds crunched raw pasta while developing Linux. 

The thing you&#039;re not going to like, and you&#039;ll probably censor my comment for saying, is that the eccentricity of a lot of the top performers is part of what drives women away. Many women don&#039;t want to be around weird guys who don&#039;t bathe and can&#039;t make eye contact. You&#039;re probably fine with it, and some women do like geeks, but most don&#039;t. And given the enormous importance placed on conformity and social skills in mainstream society (excessive in my view...we took the &#039;cool&#039; Bush over the &#039;geeky&#039; Gore and look what happened to our country) I think the weirdos should have at least one refuge.

Sorry, this is something I&#039;m passionate about even though I am no longer even considering a computer science career.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yah, most of the pioneers are decidedly non-well-rounded and weird to boot. C&#8217;mon, Linus Torvalds crunched raw pasta while developing Linux. </p>
<p>The thing you&#8217;re not going to like, and you&#8217;ll probably censor my comment for saying, is that the eccentricity of a lot of the top performers is part of what drives women away. Many women don&#8217;t want to be around weird guys who don&#8217;t bathe and can&#8217;t make eye contact. You&#8217;re probably fine with it, and some women do like geeks, but most don&#8217;t. And given the enormous importance placed on conformity and social skills in mainstream society (excessive in my view&#8230;we took the &#8216;cool&#8217; Bush over the &#8216;geeky&#8217; Gore and look what happened to our country) I think the weirdos should have at least one refuge.</p>
<p>Sorry, this is something I&#8217;m passionate about even though I am no longer even considering a computer science career.</p>
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		<title>By: Karen DeTerra</title>
		<link>http://www.shessuchageek.com/2007/04/17/i-guarantee-youll-see-men-in-computer-fields-stating-as-fact-that-women-dont-really-want-to-be-in-computer-science/comment-page-1/#comment-10714</link>
		<dc:creator>Karen DeTerra</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 15 May 2007 02:03:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.shessuchageek.com/2007/04/17/i-guarantee-youll-see-men-in-computer-fields-stating-as-fact-that-women-dont-really-want-to-be-in-computer-science/#comment-10714</guid>
		<description>Do not believe that being well-rounded in CS is the way to go.  It is all about specific skills sets.  What drives most people out of CS  are the insane standards of &#039;2 years experience with version 9 or 10&#039;.  You WILL NOT get the job if you have 5 years of experience with version 8.5.  nuts ... and also a lot of the &quot;b&quot; word.  I am frequently the only woman in development/engineering/testing and have been called &#039;a fuxxing douche bag&#039; and a &#039;bixch&#039;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Do not believe that being well-rounded in CS is the way to go.  It is all about specific skills sets.  What drives most people out of CS  are the insane standards of &#8216;2 years experience with version 9 or 10&#8242;.  You WILL NOT get the job if you have 5 years of experience with version 8.5.  nuts &#8230; and also a lot of the &#8220;b&#8221; word.  I am frequently the only woman in development/engineering/testing and have been called &#8216;a fuxxing douche bag&#8217; and a &#8216;bixch&#8217;.</p>
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		<title>By: tekanji</title>
		<link>http://www.shessuchageek.com/2007/04/17/i-guarantee-youll-see-men-in-computer-fields-stating-as-fact-that-women-dont-really-want-to-be-in-computer-science/comment-page-1/#comment-7475</link>
		<dc:creator>tekanji</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 22 Apr 2007 00:22:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.shessuchageek.com/2007/04/17/i-guarantee-youll-see-men-in-computer-fields-stating-as-fact-that-women-dont-really-want-to-be-in-computer-science/#comment-7475</guid>
		<description>You know, I have a passion for programming. I took Pascal and C++ in high school, would constantly be found in the science/computer shack at camp, and when I was in college I taught myself PHP and MySQL so I could more effectively program my websites.

I even had hopes of getting a comp sci minor. What prevented me, however, was that I had been constantly stunted in math and so I didn&#039;t have the background to pass calculus. My only other option was to take a no credit pre-cal class and &lt;i&gt;then&lt;/i&gt; retake calculus. Taking a no credit class is pretty much a waste of money, and since my first year comp sci class fulfilled my science requirement, I went on to do a minor in Classical Myth and Religion.

In the end it&#039;s worked out -- if I had gotten a programming minor, I might have fallen back on that, rather than seeking out schools in Japan that offer video game planning/design courses. But I do wonder what my life would have been like if I hadn&#039;t had been discouraged from math at every turn, or had had the will to fight for a proper math education, and had been able to do a comp sci minor.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You know, I have a passion for programming. I took Pascal and C++ in high school, would constantly be found in the science/computer shack at camp, and when I was in college I taught myself PHP and MySQL so I could more effectively program my websites.</p>
<p>I even had hopes of getting a comp sci minor. What prevented me, however, was that I had been constantly stunted in math and so I didn&#8217;t have the background to pass calculus. My only other option was to take a no credit pre-cal class and <i>then</i> retake calculus. Taking a no credit class is pretty much a waste of money, and since my first year comp sci class fulfilled my science requirement, I went on to do a minor in Classical Myth and Religion.</p>
<p>In the end it&#8217;s worked out &#8212; if I had gotten a programming minor, I might have fallen back on that, rather than seeking out schools in Japan that offer video game planning/design courses. But I do wonder what my life would have been like if I hadn&#8217;t had been discouraged from math at every turn, or had had the will to fight for a proper math education, and had been able to do a comp sci minor.</p>
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		<title>By: L</title>
		<link>http://www.shessuchageek.com/2007/04/17/i-guarantee-youll-see-men-in-computer-fields-stating-as-fact-that-women-dont-really-want-to-be-in-computer-science/comment-page-1/#comment-7401</link>
		<dc:creator>L</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 21 Apr 2007 03:38:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.shessuchageek.com/2007/04/17/i-guarantee-youll-see-men-in-computer-fields-stating-as-fact-that-women-dont-really-want-to-be-in-computer-science/#comment-7401</guid>
		<description>There is a very relevant Mills-Carnegie Mellon connection - Lenore Blum, Distinguished Career Professor of Computer Science at CMU since 1999, founded the Department of Math and Computer Science at Mills College in 1976.  Dr. Blum is also one of the founders of the Math/Science Network, which developed and currently licenses and coordinates the annual Expanding Your Horizons conferences.  Still, it is also true that CMU was already taking steps to bridge the gender gap before Dr. Blum joined the SCS faculty; the program described in &quot;Unlocking the Clubhouse&quot; started in 1995.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There is a very relevant Mills-Carnegie Mellon connection &#8211; Lenore Blum, Distinguished Career Professor of Computer Science at CMU since 1999, founded the Department of Math and Computer Science at Mills College in 1976.  Dr. Blum is also one of the founders of the Math/Science Network, which developed and currently licenses and coordinates the annual Expanding Your Horizons conferences.  Still, it is also true that CMU was already taking steps to bridge the gender gap before Dr. Blum joined the SCS faculty; the program described in &#8220;Unlocking the Clubhouse&#8221; started in 1995.</p>
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		<title>By: ohh_man</title>
		<link>http://www.shessuchageek.com/2007/04/17/i-guarantee-youll-see-men-in-computer-fields-stating-as-fact-that-women-dont-really-want-to-be-in-computer-science/comment-page-1/#comment-7276</link>
		<dc:creator>ohh_man</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 18 Apr 2007 23:43:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.shessuchageek.com/2007/04/17/i-guarantee-youll-see-men-in-computer-fields-stating-as-fact-that-women-dont-really-want-to-be-in-computer-science/#comment-7276</guid>
		<description>jane, i hear ya.  it&#039;s like we&#039;re 5 years old and need to be convinced to put the barbie down and start using the computer for our state of the art recipe program.

maybe women don&#039;t like to work with people who treat them like crap for stupid reasons and abuse them.  naaaah... we must just be shortsighted and dumb.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>jane, i hear ya.  it&#8217;s like we&#8217;re 5 years old and need to be convinced to put the barbie down and start using the computer for our state of the art recipe program.</p>
<p>maybe women don&#8217;t like to work with people who treat them like crap for stupid reasons and abuse them.  naaaah&#8230; we must just be shortsighted and dumb.</p>
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		<title>By: brianna</title>
		<link>http://www.shessuchageek.com/2007/04/17/i-guarantee-youll-see-men-in-computer-fields-stating-as-fact-that-women-dont-really-want-to-be-in-computer-science/comment-page-1/#comment-7258</link>
		<dc:creator>brianna</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 18 Apr 2007 17:14:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.shessuchageek.com/2007/04/17/i-guarantee-youll-see-men-in-computer-fields-stating-as-fact-that-women-dont-really-want-to-be-in-computer-science/#comment-7258</guid>
		<description>btw, I don&#039;t think it&#039;s fair to say that Carnegie Mellon learned from Mills College - CMU has been at this work for a long time and done extensive research on the subject.  Check out Margolis and Fisher&#039;s book Unlocking the Clubhouse for more information on their efforts.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>btw, I don&#8217;t think it&#8217;s fair to say that Carnegie Mellon learned from Mills College &#8211; CMU has been at this work for a long time and done extensive research on the subject.  Check out Margolis and Fisher&#8217;s book Unlocking the Clubhouse for more information on their efforts.</p>
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		<title>By: Jane</title>
		<link>http://www.shessuchageek.com/2007/04/17/i-guarantee-youll-see-men-in-computer-fields-stating-as-fact-that-women-dont-really-want-to-be-in-computer-science/comment-page-1/#comment-7256</link>
		<dc:creator>Jane</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 18 Apr 2007 15:56:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.shessuchageek.com/2007/04/17/i-guarantee-youll-see-men-in-computer-fields-stating-as-fact-that-women-dont-really-want-to-be-in-computer-science/#comment-7256</guid>
		<description>Ah, the old &quot;dumb down the major/lowering standards&quot; argument comes back!

I really wish that articles like this would focus less on &quot;how can we let women know how cool CS is?&quot; and more on &quot;gee, maybe we should, you know, look at changing the overall culture of CS?&quot;  Because I think the latter is more of a problem than the former.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ah, the old &#8220;dumb down the major/lowering standards&#8221; argument comes back!</p>
<p>I really wish that articles like this would focus less on &#8220;how can we let women know how cool CS is?&#8221; and more on &#8220;gee, maybe we should, you know, look at changing the overall culture of CS?&#8221;  Because I think the latter is more of a problem than the former.</p>
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